The Graffe's Celebrity Death Pool

[Delores Mulva]

[Tinthalas Tigris]

I loved gilbert gottfried.

My last name is Gill and when I was a teen, I used to do prank calls all the time and say that I was gilbert gottfried. He was my first inspiration for being a comic. I never had any styling similar to him, but I would often try and impersonate his perspective.

I *loved* him like no other comic.

I didn't go out of my way to see him like other comics, such as robin williams or mitch hedburg.

But Gilbert Gottfried was just like none other. I just loved watching and seeing him.

[PPatty]

Forgot to drop this in yesterday, but this was the greatest goal scorer in NHL history, bar none. Others have more goals because of longevity, but no one was better at it than Bossy, a seminal sports figure for anyone who grew up in the NY metro area in the 80s:

https://www.newsday.com/sports/hocke...-dead-s0ht2l7x

[Delores Mulva]

Very sad, key part of one of the last dynasties in the NHL, but....

Forgot to drop this in yesterday, but this was the greatest goal scorer in NHL history, bar none. Others have more goals because of longevity, but no one was better at it than Bossy....

Bossy - 0.762 G/GP over 752 games.
Mario Lemieux - 0.7754 G/GP over 915 games.

I'd argue that being able to score at almost the same pace but over a career that's over 20% longer makes Lemieux the better goal scorer. It's the "past his prime" games that beat up on a player's G/GP, and Lemieux had a lot more of those and still kept almost the same pace. Shit, Mario played over 300 games after getting and being treated for cancer!

Then you get into the era-adjusted stuff, and you really beat up on Bossy's numbers because of him playing in the most inflated era in league history. Bossy's 573 goals get knocked down to 461 with an era adjustment: link. Compare that to another top sniper, Pavel Bure, whose 437 career goals get adjusted up to 463, or Ovechkin going from 776 to 885. Bossy was great - one of the few members of the true 50 in 50 club - but "greatest... bar none"? No, there's debate and it's fair debate.

[PPatty]

I'd argue that being able to score at almost the same pace but over a career that's over 20% longer makes Lemieux the better goal scorer. It's the "past his prime" games that beat up on a player's G/GP, and Lemieux had a lot more of those and still kept almost the same pace.

Mario's per-game stats are skewed by '87-'89 — phenomenal seasons, no question, but no one has matched Bossy's nine straight of 50+ goals. Mario did it seven times total over 17 seasons; maybe if he didn't have the bad back, things would have been different, but you can say the same for Bossy, whose career ended prematurely because of back problems, and, to a lesser extent, knee issues.

And if we want to start adjusting for everything, Mario had the advantage of being surrounded by more offensive talent in his prime to take the pressure off -- when you have a season where Jaromir Jagr is only fifth on the team with a "mere" 94 points, the roster is stacked. On the Isles, after Bossy you had Trots (who was reduced to a 3rd-line center on Mario's Pens), then quite the drop-off to Gillies and Tonelli, who were good-but-not-great on offense.

[Delores Mulva]

Mario's per-game stats are skewed by '87-'89 — phenomenal seasons, no question, but no one has matched Bossy's nine straight of 50+ goals.

With good reason - Bossy played in the biggest scoring era the game has ever seen. And if I'm looking to add a "best ever goal scorer", do I consider that to be the guy whose best season ranks 17th on the all-time goals in a season list (Bossy), or the guy who has four seasons better than 17th (Lemieux)? Do I pick the guy who led the league in goals two seasons (Bossy), or the one who did it three times (Lemieux)? How about I pick the guy who got better than a goal per game twice (Lemieux), versus the guy who was never even close to that (Bossy)?

And if we want to start adjusting for everything, Mario had the advantage of being surrounded by more offensive talent in his prime to take the pressure off....

Did he? Let's look at Bossy's best years:

'77-'78 - Isles have three of the top six scorers in the league.
'78-'79 - Isles have four of the top ten scorers in the league.
'81-'82 - Isles have two of the top five scorers in the league.

Now let's look at Mario during the years you singled out, '87-'89, the year Jagr got the "mere" 94 points ('92-'93), and the one other season Mario did really well, '95-'96.

'86-'87 - Only Mario in top ten from the Pens.
'87-'88 - Only Mario in top ten.
'88-'89 - Three Pens in top six.
'92-'93 - Only Mario in top ten.
'95-'96 - Three Pens in top four.

Most seasons, Mario was carrying that team when he put up those numbers. One of the guys in '88-'89 that was in the top six was Rob "I get all my points when Mario bounces pucks off me" Brown! With Bossy, you have Trottier (who was the only Isle in the top ten in scoring for a few of Bossy's years), and you have one of the greatest offensive defensemen to ever play the game, Potvin, in his prime. The one guy who really could have carried the load for Mario, Jagr? Jagr led the league in scoring, while on the Pens, five different seasons. In those five seasons Mario played a total of 43 games.

On the Isles, after Bossy you had Trots (who was reduced to a 3rd-line center on Mario's Pens)....

This is one heck of a dishonest comparison, implying Trottier was not amazing with the Isles because he was a third liner when he was age 34+ with the Penguins. Are we entering the part of the discussion where you'll say just about anything to make your position look good?

[Zarbonius]

Forgot to drop this in yesterday, but this was the greatest goal scorer in NHL history, bar none. Others have more goals because of longevity, but no one was better at it than Bossy, a seminal sports figure for anyone who grew up in the NY metro area in the 80s:

Yeesh.

Stolen from another board, but:

At 30 years old Bossy had 573 goals in 752 games (0.762 goals per game). He didn't play a game past 30.

At 30 years old Mario had 563 goals in 669 games (0.842 goals per game).
From 31 to 35 Mario only played 119 games, but scored 85 goals (0.714)
From 36 to 40 he only scored 42 goals in 127 games (0.331)

Apples to apples (prime) comparison, Lemieux was better. Peak comparison, Lemieux was better and it's not particularly close.

Just say Bossy was one of the greatest scorers, and everybody agrees. Making "the greatest" claims is unnecessarily controversial, especially when it's this much of a stretch.

[PPatty]

As I said, Mario's best years were phenomenal, but no one has been as consistently great of a scorer as Bossy, so I'm putting Bossy at No. 1. I'm surprised that this is considered a controversial statement.

[PPatty]

I guess it's that generation's time to shine in the obits section, as the hockey hits keep coming:

Hockey Hall of Famer Guy Lafleur dies at age 70

[Bonlainy]

The "Mad Bomber" dies:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...ca-dies-age-80

He was one of the "old school" Raiders that made me a fan of them when I was a kid, loved the bombs he threw.

[PPatty]

The timing of Lamonica's death drives home how young Madden was when he took over the Raiders -- he was only five years older than his starting QB, and actually quite a bit younger than the backup. Al Davis really had something going with that team at the time.

[Delores Mulva]

Lafleur had been off his cancer meds for a bit now, so it was expected. Still sad, though. I was at his last game in Vancouver with the Nordiques, and the Canucks gave him a reclining chair to enjoy in his retirement (everyone knew it was his final season). Not many players get given gifts by opposing teams.

[PPatty]

If there were a Mt. Rushmore of comic book artists, this guy would be on it:

Neal Adams, Trailblazing Comic Book Creator, Dies at 80 (cbr.com)

[PPatty]

Country music icon in her own right, and also the mom of Ashley and Wynona:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/ent...76/9601522002/

[Nerkahia]

If there were a Mt. Rushmore of comic book artists, this guy would be on it:

Yep, he is actually my all time favorite comic book artist. He has many of the most iconic covers in history. -Truly legendary.

I've got most of his key Batman, Superman and Green Lantern issues.

I just picked up GL 85 and 87 (the last two GL issues I needed) because the values are going to skyrocket.

[PPatty]

And another superhero artist passes beyond The Source. One of the most popular comic-book illustrators of the 1980s, and though his particular brand of "realistic" rendering wasn't widely emulated, he did draw the series that remains the template for brand-wide crossovers:

https://www.ign.com/articles/george-...ist-dies-at-67

[Nerkahia]

Dayumn, that's sad. Another favorite.

[Ackar]

Fred Ward, star of 'The Right Stuff,' 'Remo Williams' and 'Tremors,' dies at 79

[Bonlainy]

Fred Ward, star of 'The Right Stuff,' 'Remo Williams' and 'Tremors,' dies at 79

I really enjoyed him as an actor, I just with Remo Williams had been allowed to continue his adventure. RIP

[Ackar]

Rosmarie Trapp of the ‘Sound of Music’ Family Dies at 93