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Thread: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

  1. #61
    Banjo Duellist, 8th Dan
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    arming the most extreme, SICK, perverse, vicious and sadistic Islamic state can't possibly go wrong, eh?
    *said with sarcasm mode set to extreme!*

    recipe for absolute fucking disaster is what that is. yeesh!


    US should have invaded Saudi for 9/11 if it had wanted to get at the real culprits
    though of course, 9/11 *was* dirty as hell
    all the scumbags are scratching each others' backs, it's all a massive circle jerk

    "It's all a bloody game to you bastards, isn't it?"

  2. #62
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Schezar View Post
    If it really bothers you that much take the silver lining that by unshackling us from ME oil, the SA can easily be cut off in the future without hurting the US.
    That's not how global oil markets work.

  3. #63
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Trump claims that the CIA report isn't that definitive, and they really didn't reach any conclusion...

    The CIA has a phone call recording of MBS ordering the killing

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...rt/2085273002/

    That sounds pretty definitive to me

  4. #64
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by FilanFyretracker View Post
    No its not how it should be we should not just let it slide that they whacked a reporter for a US paper, I bet you would be calling for blood if it had been a reporter for the Praise Trump Channel err Fox News.
    My position isn't based on Trump, but about where our priorities should be on a national level. If Fox hired a foreign national who was in exile, but stupid enough to go into an embassy alone like that I would think that was Darwin in action as well. Saudi citizen killed in Saudi embassy somewhere not the US? Why the fuck should we be involved at all? Sorry, but I believe in the sovereignty of nations. Before, SA had us by the balls because they (OPEC) were our main source for oil, so cutting them off could become a nationally destabilizing issue. Now all they offer is money and a somewhat useful strategically located ally in the ME.
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  5. #65

    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Schezar View Post
    foreign national who was in exile, but stupid enough to go into an embassy alone like that I would think that was Darwin in action as well. Saudi citizen killed in Saudi embassy somewhere not the US? Why the fuck should we be involved at all? Sorry, but I believe in the sovereignty of nations.
    Yea, this. I still cant fathom why he would go into the embassy in the first place. Terrible thing, countries killing their own people but we cant get up in arms over every single one that happens. Had they murdered him on US soil it'd be a different story entirely. Turkey closing their embassy seems like a reasonable thing to do.

  6. #66
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    I still cant fathom why he would go into the embassy in the first place.
    That makes me curious. Quick straw poll on luring someone into their embassy in order to assassinate them. (Please attempt to take yourself back in history to September 2018 before answering.)

    1) Just another Tuesday. Who the hell falls for that one in 2018?

    Or

    2) That doesn't happen. You would get caught and pay an extravagant political price.

  7. #67
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Yea, this. I still cant fathom why he would go into the embassy in the first place.
    Well, that's because you haven't been paying attention. He needed to get some documents at the embassy in order to get married.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Terrible thing, countries killing their own people but we cant get up in arms over every single one that happens.
    Pretty straightforward straw man argument here - if we equate being concerned about THIS murder with being up in arms about EVERY murder, then we don't have to think too much about what the implications are here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Had they murdered him on US soil it'd be a different story entirely. Turkey closing their embassy seems like a reasonable thing to do.
    To be clear, he was not murdered on Turkish soil. And had this happened in the Saudi embassy in the US, it would not have been on US soil either. I assume you think simply closing the saudi embassy in Washington would have been sufficient in that situation too?

  8. #68

    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarbonius View Post
    Well, that's because you haven't been paying attention. He needed to get some documents at the embassy in order to get married.
    Oh I've been paying attention. Given his history with Saudi Arabia and their history with how they deal with dissidents....I cant fathom why he would go into the embassy. Surely getting paperwork to get married cant be worth ones life. He must have known this was a possibility.

    then we don't have to think too much about what the implications are here.
    Those implications are? Saudia Arabia can murder any of their citizens, journalist or otherwise, on Saudi soil? Isn't that already happening and has been for quite some time?

    To be clear, he was not murdered on Turkish soil. And had this happened in the Saudi embassy in the US, it would not have been on US soil either. I assume you think simply closing the saudi embassy in Washington would have been sufficient in that situation too?
    I understand how embassies work. I'm advocating kicking their diplomats out of the country and severing diplomatic ties between them and host country where the murders took place.Not simply closing a building. Yes, if it happened in the US I'd advocate the same thing.

  9. #69
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Oh I've been paying attention. Given his history with Saudi Arabia and their history with how they deal with dissidents....I cant fathom why he would go into the embassy. Surely getting paperwork to get married cant be worth ones life. He must have known this was a possibility.
    Prior to MBS, this wasn't an entirely unreasonable decision to make (seriously - find me another instance of this kind of thing). Which is, you know, the point. Trump is enabling MBS' aggressive actions by refusing to condemn them, let alone acting as a Saudi PR rep.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Those implications are? Saudia Arabia can murder any of their citizens, journalist or otherwise, on Saudi soil? Isn't that already happening and has been for quite some time?
    So you have no problem with abandoning any pretense of America having any values other than the pursuit of profit? I mean, we can go into how this undercuts most of the principles underlying the granting of foreign embassies, but you don't seem to care much about that either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    I understand how embassies work. I'm advocating kicking their diplomats out of the country and severing diplomatic ties between them and host country where the murders took place.Not simply closing a building. Yes, if it happened in the US I'd advocate the same thing.
    That's awesome. I mean, you apparently have no moral center whatsoever, so it's not surprising that you wouldn't be concerned with your country literally selling out its morality, much less its sovereignty ("come to the US, kill someone, get a diplomatic slap on the wrist - as long as you give us money, we'll still sell you weapons. Oh, and don't worry about that embassy; it'll be open again in a year or two").

  10. #70
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Senate votes to debate on US support for the Yemen war, 63-37:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46376807

    There's members of the 63 that still support the Saudis in the war, so this isn't an "end the war" vote like it may first seem. But it is a strong rebuke of the President's position on the Khashoggi murder.

  11. #71

    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarbonius View Post
    Prior to MBS, this wasn't an entirely unreasonable decision to make (seriously - find me another instance of this kind of thing). Which is, you know, the point. Trump is enabling MBS' aggressive actions by refusing to condemn them, let alone acting as a Saudi PR rep.
    You cant be serious. Its not unreasonable to think that a regime that routinely murders dissidents would murder a dissident?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarbonius View Post
    So you have no problem with abandoning any pretense of America having any values other than the pursuit of profit? I mean, we can go into how this undercuts most of the principles underlying the granting of foreign embassies, but you don't seem to care much about that either.
    We have values. I just cant get super worked up over someone who was murdered by walking into a clear death trap. But there is this. Trump is in a trade war with China to see who blinks first. Its impacting China's economy and it seems like they will give in. But its also impacting us, just not to as large of an extent. Powell also raised interest rates (and very recently changed his opinion). The OPEC production meeting just happened after all of this murder talk was underway.Had we pissed off the Saudis they would likely have raised oil prices and truly thrown our economy in the dumps. I'm completely fine not publicly condemning a state murdering one of their citizens, especially when its one of many, in order to not send us into a recession. Economically it was the right decision for America. However, Im more in favour of cutting off completely from foreign oil and getting all of our needs met through domestic production. In that case, we can wag our finger at other countries till our hearts content. But the liberals wont allow that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarbonius View Post
    That's awesome. I mean, you apparently have no moral center whatsoever, so it's not surprising that you wouldn't be concerned with your country literally selling out its morality, much less its sovereignty ("come to the US, kill someone, get a diplomatic slap on the wrist - as long as you give us money, we'll still sell you weapons. Oh, and don't worry about that embassy; it'll be open again in a year or two").
    Hey man, I think I've been respectful to you during this dialogue. Id appreciate you not making moral judgements against me based on a few lines typed into a message board. I'm really not one to be questioned on morality. To clarify...I'm talking about kicking their diplomats out of the country and severing diplomatic ties until such time they can prove they deserve to reinstate diplomatic relations. In my mind that'd hardly a slap on the wrist. What would you propose?

  12. #72
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    I'm completely fine not publicly condemning a state murdering one of their citizens, especially when its one of many, in order to not send us into a recession.
    Quote Originally Posted by Utilaelr View Post
    Hey man, I think I've been respectful to you during this dialogue. Id appreciate you not making moral judgements against me based on a few lines typed into a message board. I'm really not one to be questioned on morality.
    This word you keep using. I do not think it means what you think it means.

  13. #73
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    The Senate wants out of supporting the war with Yemen:

    https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...-on-saudi-vote

    Slowly but surely.

  14. #74

    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    And now they are helping suspected felons jump bail from US soil
    https://www.oregonlive.com/expo/news...ling-a-po.html

    its too bad we did not know what plane it was we could have forced it to land under threat of shootdown.

    The saudis better hope none of their officials visit portland and do something like park in front of a fire hydrant. City might tow without any regard for the diplomatic plates. "Sorry about that, yea we saw the plates but we gave as many fucks about your diplomatic status as you did about our bail system have a nice day pick up your suburban when the impound opens in the morning".
    "When you name your baby Jeeves...you've pretty much set up his career for life. You don't see many Hit Men, for example, named Jeeves. "Pardon me sir, but I must wack you now."
    — Jerry Seinfeld

  15. #75
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    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Looks like the Saudis have been handing off American military technology to groups to earn loyalty in Yemen, groups that have then been losing it to groups linked to Iran:

    https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019...-lost-us-arms/

    The Saudis had best promise to build another Trump hotel, fast!

  16. #76

    Re: Saudi Arabia may have murdered someone in their consulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Delores Mulva View Post
    Looks like the Saudis have been handing off American military technology to groups to earn loyalty in Yemen, groups that have then been losing it to groups linked to Iran:

    https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019...-lost-us-arms/

    The Saudis had best promise to build another Trump hotel, fast!
    Naw its reported by CNN, Trump will call it fake news and move on after a few dozen tweets and maybe another reporter slipping and falling on a bone saw.
    "When you name your baby Jeeves...you've pretty much set up his career for life. You don't see many Hit Men, for example, named Jeeves. "Pardon me sir, but I must wack you now."
    — Jerry Seinfeld

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