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Thread: What exactly is a hostile environment?

  1. #181
    Lord Inquisitor Lenin
    Eamin's Avatar
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    I do think that allowing moderation sans report is a good idea.

  2. #182
    Elder Arcanist

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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apallohadas View Post
    Feel free to put me on ignore. You've yet to say anything, even on the most trivial of topics, that I've yet to find worthwhile. And it'll probably save your mouse a few clicks between you hammering 'report post'.

    Actually for the record, I dont believe I've ever reported a post made by you about me. Honestly I have pretty thick skin, just some people can get under it with certain comments as a few years ago.

  3. #183
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lunal View Post
    Agree on the second point. The report-based moderation is great in terms of "feeling" democratic, but in reality it just means people that don't tend to complain (like Torcer, for instance) will just have shit bottle up inside of them until they blow. Having mods be allowed to moderate both in response to reports and on their own could ameliorate that.
    I agree with this.

  4. #184
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    MSEvangelista

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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apallohadas View Post
    I don't have access to your crystal ball, so yeah, I'm ignoring whatever future timeline you have access to. If you were however tapped in to some special Moderator Forecaster, you'd probably have banned Dmitry 6 months ago.
    Funny you should say that becuase I banned him three years ago...

  5. #185
    Mr. Angsty Spice
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Funny you should say that becuase I banned him three years ago...
    Right you've banned him, Grindel's banned him, Voca's banned him, GRAFFE banned him...

    Who's next on the list?
    I've got beer to drink and You guys are wasting my time.

  6. #186

    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
    Right you've banned him, Grindel's banned him, Voca's banned him, GRAFFE banned him...

    Who's next on the list?
    You mom? What it's a joooooke.

  7. #187
    Chair warmer, Sector 7G
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    I will ask my Mom to ban you, Dmitry. But not all night long, she can only ban a little bit these days, it'll have to be "Wham Ban Thank You Man."

  8. #188
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnizmo View Post
    The problem exists on both sides. The concept of debating the posts rather than the poster is dead, and the liberal side has more bodies admittedly. We really do need to let mods moderate without a report.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lunal View Post
    Agree on the second point. The report-based moderation is great in terms of "feeling" democratic, but in reality it just means people that don't tend to complain (like Torcer, for instance) will just have shit bottle up inside of them until they blow. Having mods be allowed to moderate both in response to reports and on their own could ameliorate that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eamin View Post
    I do think that allowing moderation sans report is a good idea.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grindel View Post
    I agree with this.
    Well, time to put up a vote then? Looks to me like we've got a bit of bipartisan agreement here.
    "Better an honest enemy than a shitty friend that's robbing you blind."

  9. #189
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Etelka View Post
    Well, time to put up a vote then? Looks to me like we've got a bit of bipartisan agreement here.
    Yes, the goal is to put it up for a vote, I'm just trying to find the time to dope out whether to make it part of a larger process or not. And no, that doesn't mean I'm considering going Dictator Admin, it's just that if you change one rule it interplays with all the other ones. I'd rather not have it interplay in some unforeseen way that opens up a bunch of loopholes or more ambiguity.

  10. #190
    Lord Inquisitor Lenin
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    It's about time we had a rule overhaul. I'd like to see the mods be given a lot more discretion to mod as they please.

  11. #191
    This *will* hurt a bit.
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Yes, the goal is to put it up for a vote, I'm just trying to find the time to dope out whether to make it part of a larger process or not. And no, that doesn't mean I'm considering going Dictator Admin, it's just that if you change one rule it interplays with all the other ones. I'd rather not have it interplay in some unforeseen way that opens up a bunch of loopholes or more ambiguity.
    The part that would need to be rewritten seems pretty limited. It wouldn't affect any part of the rule set, it's limited to this section of the moderator guidelines:

    In order to prevent disruption to the boards rules 1-3 will be actively enforced. Moderators may also move misplaced posts to more appropriate locations.

    Moderation falling under the other rules is reactively enforced in response to reports. When reading reports Moderators should ask themselves whether a reasonable person (in the legal sense) would view the behaviour as a violation of the rules.
    Rules 1-3 are "no spam, no porn, no private info" btw.
    I'm not *certain*, but it doesn't look like changing this would interplay anywhere else.
    "Better an honest enemy than a shitty friend that's robbing you blind."

  12. #192
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eamin View Post
    It's about time we had a rule overhaul. I'd like to see the mods be given a lot more discretion to mod as they please.
    Ah yes, like the good old days when people got warned and eventually banned for even DISCUSSING the Moderation system. NO THANKS.

  13. #193
    Lord Inquisitor Lenin
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    We have elections now, dumbass.

  14. #194
    No prison can hold me!
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Grindel would put a quick halt to any old school type abuses. He's good like that.
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    I *AM* the Chinpokomon master!

  15. #195
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    How about changing:

    "In order to prevent disruption to the boards rules 1-3 will be actively enforced. Moderators may also move misplaced posts to more appropriate locations.

    Moderation falling under the other rules is reactively enforced in response to reports. When reading reports Moderators should ask themselves whether a reasonable person (in the legal sense) would view the behaviour as a violation of the rules"

    to

    "All rules can and will be actively enforced. Moderators may also move posts actively or start new topics with posts if the previous topic is getting too derailed. If you feel a post needs to be moderated for any reason, please use the report feature.

    The role of the moderator is to keep the forums as a whole running smoothly. Among these duties are to maintain the flow of discussion. Also, removing inappropriate content such as spam or porn, and settling disputes that may arise. All membership is expected to maintain civil behavior, including moderators."
    Life has taught us that love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction.

  16. #196
    Chair warmer, Sector 7G
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eamin View Post
    We have elections now, dumbass.
    If your election lasts more than four hours, then consult a physician, DUMBASS!

  17. #197
    PROOF PROOF!
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lunal View Post
    The role of the moderator is to keep the forums as a whole running smoothly.
    Yes.
    Among these duties are to maintain the flow of discussion.
    No. When has it been the moderator's job to control conversation?
    Every married man is wrong. We just wait for the wife to tell us when, where, and about what.

    ~me

  18. #198
    This *will* hurt a bit.
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Lunal, I'd like the change to be a bit more incremental. What I had in mind is something like this:
    If you feel that any post is in violation of any rules as set out in the ruleset, then please use the report function. Moderators will only act if a post is in violation of the rules, but are not obliged to wait until a post is actually reported. On occasions, misplaced posts might be moved to more appropriate locations. Before taking any action moderators will ask themselves whether a reasonable person (in the legal sense) would view the behaviour as a violation of the rules"
    1. Removing the "reactive" part in the guideline does not mean that the reports should go overboard imo. Stating that the rules will be (only?) actively enforced from now on seems to me to imply that they would (probably incidentally?).
    2. That "reasonable person" part is crucial. That really shouldn't be scrapped.
    3. "Among these duties are to maintain the flow of discussion.": I don't know about that one. Why do you think that this change would be necessary?
    "Better an honest enemy than a shitty friend that's robbing you blind."

  19. #199
    Ancient Arcanist
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apallohadas View Post
    No. When has it been the moderator's job to control conversation?
    Not "control." That wasn't intended. I see controlling civility as being a duty done to maintain the flow of discussion. Of course, for any of this to work we have to trust the moderators to make their own decisions rather than relying on reports.
    Life has taught us that love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction.

  20. #200
    PROOF PROOF!
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    Re: What exactly is a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lunal View Post
    Not "control." That wasn't intended. I see controlling civility as being a duty done to maintain the flow of discussion. Of course, for any of this to work we have to trust the moderators to make their own decisions rather than relying on reports.
    I disagree. I'd say that easily half of the threads in General stray to off-topic realms, often more interesting than the original subject. Incivility is 'f-you you f-ing f-er and I'll f- your eyeballs outta their f-ing sockets!!1211". Dealing with that is what Moderators are for.

    'Maintaining' the flow of conversation is not the moderators job at all. That'd be a pretty crappy place to visit.
    Every married man is wrong. We just wait for the wife to tell us when, where, and about what.

    ~me

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